#1 Kat's Sourdough - Bread, Body, and Balance

Amy (00:00) Welcome to Just a Thought with Amy Keys. We are here to inspire, educate, inform, and entertain. On today's episode, I'm so excited to welcome entrepreneur, bakery owner, and innovator of recipes, mom of four, wife, fitness trainer, success story, and really nice person, Kat with Kat Sourdough.

Kat (00:24) It is great to be here. Thank you for that sweet introduction.

Amy (00:28) Those are some good descriptions. Pretty accurate. Pretty accurate. Thank

Kat (00:30) Thank you.

Amy (00:31) you. So so excited to have cats. If anybody that knows me knows I'm a real big fan girl of Kat and her bakery. And so I thought it would be fun to discuss how we met, get right to it. We're going to talk about fitness, sourdough, business, all kinds of fun stuff today. All right. But I love how I met you when you were literally selling bread.

Beautiful bread loaves from your porch. Yes. And I would come and porch pickup once a week because we had to have our fix every week. And there was always the little black cat. Was the cat's name? Bill He

Kat (01:09) Billy.

Amy (01:09) was roaming around and would come and visit, super friendly. And then you slowly and then boom quickly evolved. Yes. then you were in one of my little markets, you showed up, you sold seventy loaves in two hours.

And you got to leave because you had nothing else because you started selling out and your business evolution has been so exciting to watch. Yes. I think two things that I've noticed in most of it is determination and drive. I think those would be huge descriptions for you. So tell me something about in your little evolution in the beginning.

Like what were your goals to start with? How did you even think, I'm gonna start on the porch and then have a

Kat (02:00) Yeah. And I think people are really surprised when I tell them that that just definitely was not the plan. I obviously I started selling it. Well, I started making it for health reasons and taking it to local gym events. People obviously loved the bread and started asking to buy it. So I was like, I'm not gonna make you buy this. I love making it anyways. I can just make an extra loaf or whatever.

But Christmas time came around and I was like, hey, four kids are expensive. Let's put it on the bulletin board and see if other people are interested in this delicious bread. So from that moment, and it really always has been about the bread, though we've obviously added more products, but that bread and the same bread that we make today just took off and it has been a matter of just keeping up with demand ever since.

It's really a whirlwind. I have to kinda pinch myself. I just can't believe that w this is my life now. Because it was never the plan.

When I did start selling it quickly because obviously there was logistical issues with the demand that there was and being in my kitchen. So there was no planning ahead of time of what the demand was gonna be. I wanted to actually go the route of selling it online, teaching it. So I hired a social media manager and that was kind of the direction that I wanted to go because I couldn't really think how am I gonna

continue to keep doing this, but I could teach it and I enjoyed making it. So that was kind of the route that I was going to go is teach it online and make it into, you know, a little business that way. Obviously the demand just kept growing, kept growing, kept growing. And the first time the bakery entered my mind was Christmas of 2023, I believe. My it's been a whirlwind.

But there was like 25 people lined out my door for Christmas. And I thought, wow, I have to open up a bakery, I think. I don't like telling people no. So while I didn't really advertise much, the word of mouth was just and it still has been. You know, still to this day we've not done any marketing. I haven't paid for any marketing.

Amy (04:24) Amazing.

Kat (04:25) It's it's literally been word of mouth and it's truly been humbling to see the response from the community from day one.

But yeah, that's a little bit about how we started, kind of what the goal was in the beginning and where we are now.

Amy (04:41) Success a a wonderful success story. And one of the things that does stand out to me and always has is the power of word of mouth for a small business. Mm-hmm. And the power word of mouth for you is consistency. People know like I know when I come to get my bread every Thursday, I'm gonna get the same texture, the same slice size that I got the week before. And also you're just a likable person. well thank you. And people want people want to support you.

And

Kat (05:11) Well, I think they they and this is true. I I I and I hope that they feel the love. My recipes and the things that we come up with, what I've learned about baking is recipes are very similar, you know, within a few grams of things, maybe a little a difference between using oil versus butter. You know, there's some tweaks that you can make, but I think it really through this process ended up

resonating with me when people used to say, Well, no one can make it like grandma. It's the love, you know? Yeah. And

I don't know, I just remember thinking, I mean, it's just bread. Like I it has to be the love because you know, I'm following a recipe just like anybody else can. Yep. But I truly have always loved serving people and I am a people person and I've I care about the product that they're getting and that it's it's the right way. And that's the only thing that I've ever been able to think of how this has become so successful is that the love is really there, you know.

Amy (06:14) Has anything surprised you in the opening of the bakery? Like has anything been like, I didn't expect that or I'm

anything that you're like, Wow, like I mean, you know, there's times the bakery's really busy.

Kat (06:29) Yeah. So much. I I definitely went into it blinded, which is fine. You know, you it it's part of it. the response from the community, obviously, like I've already spoken about, has continued to blow me away. Just the support has truly been overwhelming. The fact that we've been able to hit the numbers that we've hit, I can't believe I I literally vividly remember.

Making five loaves in my house being stressed about how am I gonna make five loaves? How am I gonna make five customers happy, you know? Yeah. I remember. And now it's like making a hundred loaves a day. And that's

Amy (07:11) How many you make a day of sandwich bread?

Kat (07:13) of sandwich bread. Wow. And so like that reality just blows me away. Yeah. Just the like

Amy (07:21) Gross.

Kat (07:22) Scale and like what we've been able to accomplish under really not so great circumstances with the the building that we're in. I'm I'm so proud of my team. I'm just so proud of where we've come. I was not expecting, again, this just goes into not having done anything like this before. The the location that we're in, a lot of people don't know this, but it was built out specifically to be a juice bar.

So it wasn't a restaurant, it wasn't a cafe, it wasn't a bakery, it was a juice bar, and that's what it was built out for. And they left their equipment for us. They didn't want to resell it or anything. And that's how the juice bar came to be. But we've had lots of challenges with how to where we are a mini restaurant. We're a cafe type situation and a bakery. And that space is not built out for either. So that was a big surprise for me.

learning that because I just kept I I in the first few months I kept thinking, Why is this so clunky? Like why is it so hard? Like why is this so hard? It doesn't make any sense to me, you know, it's just juices, you know? Yeah. Things are a lot more clear to me now. Yeah. Well you

Amy (08:35) You

learn in the whole process. But one thing that surprised me as a fangirl and loyal customer is I did not expect to it to become such a community gathering spot.

Kat (08:49) yeah.

Amy (08:49) I have met friends there a lot for lunch. Yeah. And when we stay there for like two hours because it's a pleasant place to be, yes. That you've done something right with as you said, a clunky start. Like we like we sit

around the same area there. And there's certain people I meet up there or a little shout out to Jeannie Swan and her husband. They come up and I think they get each a smoothie and they share grilled cheese. Yeah. And it's like tradition. Yes. There's people that come up there for tradition. And I don't usually go to a two hour lunch, but there's something about cats that makes you want to stay.

Kat (09:24) And I love that. Like I don't think I could have ever expected just like it it becomes your home and it be the community becomes your family. Like it it I I often explain it to people like I feel like I adopted not only my own employees where I'm like, Well, I have you know, I adopted twenty children overnight, you know, and then the community as well. Like the responsibility I feel on a daily basis, I

was also not expecting. Yeah. But like seeing the place full, seeing people enjoy themselves, like, it's a joy beyond measure, truly. Just trying to create a space where people are making memories. There's a little boy that comes in every Saturday with his father. I like it just is the sweetest thing ever because I know like that's something that that little boy will remember for the rest his life, you know? Yes. Every Saturday. And it's like

To the point where it's like, if I don't see him, I'm like, I wonder if they're out of town, you know, like

Amy (10:26) Well you're you're very invested in your the people. Like anytime I'm in there, if you're able, you go out of your way to talk to me. And you're not just like, Hey Amy, we like talk for a minute, yeah, solve a few real problems and then say goodbye and I leave with my sandwich bread and my croutons and my crackers. Yes. So speaking of being in the bakery, like how what's a day of the in the life of Cat's sourdough?

Kat (10:51) There's always something. We are working with a very untamed product, you know, unpredictable product. So our day starts at 4 a.m. every single day, and we start making the dough. We're always, you know, like I said, it's a 24-hour, seven day a week, 365-day a year process because we're keeping a living organism alive. So that

Obviously, again, has presented some challenges. It's a difficult business model, but every day I have a baker that gets there at four AM and they start the process. Typically the mornings are prep work, you know, for the day. They're getting all the doughs ready that need to be fermented and prepping and getting everything ready for the day. Having a seven AM open time is challenging.

Amy (11:39) Inductive. Yeah. Yeah. Just

Kat (11:41) Because there's a lot that because the process is slow, there's a lot that has to be done first thing in the morning. So, you know, just even being able to staff that has been a challenge in that four a.m. time. But I have bakers, like I said, four a.m. Another shift comes in between like nine, around nine o'clock. They stay till around two two or three. And then I have another baker that comes in two and stays till about ten or eleven. When

Amy (12:08) So and

your bakers come in that early. Are you there too? No. Okay. So that I used to that that is very impressive because that is your starter. Yeah. Your product. yeah. And you have to really trust your your employees. You have a lot of trust and I'm proud of you for that 'cause it's not always easy. It's not easy to just trust someone with your brand.

Kat (12:29) remember yes, that I remember when I w for a good while, not only was I doing it, I was doing it for, you know, several months and those were some long days, you know, seventeen, eighteen hours and lots of lots of struggle there. But then having someone else there was almost even harder, you know? Yeah.

I remember thinking, I wonder if I'll ever sleep past 4 a.m. again because it'd be like four a.m. my phone would just start going off like questions, this problem, what do we do here? You know, we've come a long way.

Amy (13:04) Yeah, in a quick in a quick

Kat (13:06) I

and and I think that also looping back, I probably will loop back to this, that was another thing that I never really considered is much like having children, you're never off.

Amy (13:17) True. It's a baby.

Kat (13:18) It's your baby and at any like, especially because I have people there twenty four seven minus about four hours, they're in the back of my mind, even if I'm not there, like there's there's you're always on call. Yep, you know, and always

What's the next thing to troubleshoot and to fix?

Amy (13:38) There's always something. And I'm sure that no two days are ever

Kat (13:41) Literally.

Amy (13:42) and I'm sure with I'm sure having a sourdough starter that's the base of your product it gets a little moody, doesn't it?

Kat (13:51) It does. We've come a long way with that. Again, just when I moved to the bakery, different atmosphere, different every everything was different. So learning its kind of personality in a new setting. And then just different hands on it. You know, you have a lot of different hands on it e except for yourself. I did not realize how intuitive of a person or baker that I was.

So when it came to training people, that was very hard for me because I didn't I mean, think of painting, you know, you can tell me like how to draw a rose and a one, two, three, four. Right, you know, but it's not gonna look like yours. Right. You know, because of all the nuances that makes you an artist, you know, and me not.

Amy (14:38) Right. Right. Right. Right.

Kat (14:42) That

You know, I would just be like, well, like I I just didn't know there was like to me it was simple, but it's not to someone else.

Amy (14:51) Yeah. And and I remember when you came here, I had only known you a few months and I was like, Would you do a sourdough class? Yeah. For me and some friends. And you came to the house and you taught us and I thought I was sourdough queen. I was making sourdough once a week. I ha I love the process, the kneading. Yeah. It's so soothing to do all that and then watch the everything. yeah. But I never had a loaf like yours. Yeah. So I get it. Like even you you showed me what to do. Yeah. And I follow the instructions.

Everything that you told me to do, but I still

Kat (15:23) Because like I've even had people, I'm like, do they think I'm like holding back or like not telling 'cause they're like, well, it didn't turn out like yours or it didn't taste like yours. I'm like, I promise you I'm telling you everything. but you know, that's just that is like it took me a minute to realize that, like that this is an art, it's a skill. Yep. And nailing the consistency and knowing what to do in different circumstances and different environments is really the craft of it. And that was really hard to teach.

You know, that's why we learned very quickly that we need a small staff and to invest in them, treat them well, because it's just not a cookie cutter process when you're dealing with a wild that has a mind of its own.

Amy (16:06) Right. So

do you want to tell the listener the name of your starter? Yes.

Kat (16:12) Hallie. Hallie. And she has been good to me. And she we like I said, we've come a long way. But I do know that in the beginning when we opened up the bakery, like there were definitely days that we had to tell people like, hey, we're out of bread because the starter was sick. I like to call it that. And

Amy (16:30) Didn't want to do what you wanted.

Kat (16:32) you know, I really honestly looking back, I think that that has built trust with my customers to know that we're doing it the right way because there are problems. You know? Yeah.

we we have fall like when when the starter doesn't work or something goes wrong, which is going to happen, we don't have bread. Right. Because we're not getting it off of a truck and we're not taking any shortcut. And I think, you know, that has been my hope that and not like that was planned or anything, but I think people appreciate the transparency and knowing, hey, this this product actually is really made from scratch. Yeah.

Amy (17:08) Like I said earlier, I'm getting the same thing every time I go there. Yeah. So I love that. Speaking of items that you make, yes. My favorites. Well, the list is long, but the chicken salad sandwich is legit. It's my favorite. The salted crackers. Yes. The berry blast smoothies, my favorite smoothie. So if you have a whole bunch of people come in and get these things after, you just give me a shout.

I love the berry blast smoothie. I just had that for the first time last week.

Kat (17:38) Mm-hmm.

Amy (17:39) I like the silver bowl smoothie too, but the berry blast has that little kick of lime. Yeah. That's so creative. And you make all these yes recipes.

Kat (17:47) We do and some even my staff. So now I created them all at the beginning and then the Berry Birch actually was a combination of a few of us just playing around one day, which has been really fun.

Amy (18:00) Burst, not blast. yeah. My bad, my bad. Very blurst burst smoothie. Yes. So so good.

Kat (18:07) One has like quit I think we were playing around one day. I can't even remember. And I was like, this is going on the menu. like

Amy (18:15) It is so good.

Kat (18:16) this is going on and that actually recently just happened with another sandwich that's gonna be on the menu soon, but it's been our June special and people it was literally someone ordered it, they went and ate it and they came back and they ordered another one.

Amy (18:29) wow.

Kat (18:29) So we call it the a la Laney and

It's delicious, but she is she one of the employees, you know, like and I love that. Like I love that I kinda give them that space and they kind of create what their employee meal is and then they'll be like, Yeah, it taste this, it's so good. You know end up on the menu.

Amy (18:43) Yeah.

And so I love that you put a pickle on the chicken salad sandwich. That's really special. Yes.

Kat (18:51) And you know, that, just so you know, has been a challenge because finding pickles is not easy. Now we homemade we make them in house. That's new, but up until this point, probably like three, probably four weeks ago, I'd have to go to Sprouts and get the little bitty, you know, eight ounce jars of pickles because literally everywhere else you can't find pickles without preservatives, food coloring something so

Amy (19:19) Right. The

Kat (19:20) Yes, the pickles are

Amy (19:21) pickle is like the most perfect little special touch. Uh-huh. But it's the chicken salad the whole thing. And I have to have my chicken salad with a little lightly toasted bread. Yes. So I do believe have you told me in the past, or did maybe you made a post about it, that the bagels are the most time consuming product to make.

Kat (19:42) yeah. They are definitely by far our most time consuming sixteen hour process. Wow. They're there are they are a labor of love. So the I d I just don't truly think people realize how much our hands are on each one of those and the full blown process. Well

Amy (20:03) The cheddar jalapeno bagel. So good. Ten out of ten. yeah. Doesn't need anything on it. No. Doesn't need anything on it. My older son likes it. When I bring those to him out of town, they're they're so good. He's

Kat (20:14) No

shadow jalapeno. We have people that ship them to family. I have a following in Nashville apparently with the but with the bagels that I opened. It was unknown to me. Awesome. but the bagels are definitely getting out there. Like I said, it's always been about the bread from day one. I had just started doing bagels, like I don't know, maybe six weeks before we opened up the bakery. So they definitely didn't have quite the following like the bread did, but they have gr quickly grown in popularity.

And they are high skill and very temperamental.

Amy (20:48) You

have one person who makes the deals if I'm correct. Yeah.

Kat (20:51) Yeah, well yes. He does them and then I will fill in the gaps.

Amy (20:56) Yeah,

so so it's a partnership but a high level partner. He like I couldn't just come in and do that for you.

Kat (20:59) Yeah.

No, and and to be honest, with the bread, that I can I mean, my kids help me with the bread, even still to this day. You know, I was up there last weekend and my daughter shaped every loaf. and I can walk people through that. I always tell people if the dough is the where it needs to be, then I can get you to shape a successful loaf of bread.

Amy (21:22) So

if you have a following in Nashville, do you think you'll ever have multiple locations?

Kat (21:28) We definitely it's on the table. There, you know, when you get into this business, it's it's like wow, the the opportunity when you when you look back at the growth that's been had in such a short amount of time, you can't help but think of where the future lies, you know.

Amy (21:45) Yeah.

Kat (21:46) and there's so many different directions that we could go. I'm not gonna lie, like the juice bar side has been

the harder part of the process, just maybe because it's not where my expertise was. I think I was prepared as I could have been to open up a bakery, but that that whole aspect was definitely I was blindsided by and and really just learning health code and, you know, just so much. You know. But an you know, a second location is definitely something that we talk about very frequently. And we would definitely we were just waiting for the right space. We've had a couple of people actually reach out to us.

But we want it to be the right time, you know, for the business. My employees bless their hearts. They've definitely grunted through a lot the last year and a half and they're committed to the mission and the vision. But I want it to be the right time. I don't want to put unnecessary strain on us. But we definitely have looked at a second location. We flirt with that and then just diving into just shipping out the bread. Just

Making tons and tons and tons of bread and shipping it. Not that we can't do both.

Amy (22:56) Right.

Kat (22:57) but we kind of flip flop back and forth of kind of which direction we want to go

Amy (23:02) Cool.

Kat (23:02) immediately. But just whole like wholesale production of the bread has been something that we've really highly considered as well.

Amy (23:12) Well, in that in all the growth and we've we've gone back to growth a lot, but there's been so much growth that's one of the reasons I wanted to have you on the podcast. Yes. because I've been one of those people from the start who has been like one of your biggest followers and I want my people to enjoy your bread. I want them to enjoy good things. And so when they would try it, they'd be like, this is great. This is you know, and they're all coming to you too. But one thing in the process is all the growth. You haven't forgotten your your

customers. Like you have not forgotten, pardon the pun, your bread and butter customers. Yes. And your bread and butter product, which seems to be the sandwich bread. Yes. Like that seems to be like the the conduit to everything. Yes. That's and then and then you like randomly will be like, here's this kind of pie for this holiday. Or here's and I'm like, when do they have time? Yeah.

Kat (24:01) Well, you know, when you house a bunch of bakers as employees, they that's their passion during

Amy (24:05) Having

fun and they're doing all that. And you'll have like a new pie for Fa Father's Day, I think you have a new pie. Yeah. Or you'll have a new pie for this or that. I'm like, when does she sleep? When does she ever sleep?

Kat (24:17) Well, they they do have fun. Though I have to kinda hold back sometimes too, 'cause it's like, you know, we we could do you know, like everybody wants to do what they're they know that they can do really well and and it's fun, you know, and it's fun to be able to offer that to the community. But there is like lots of choices even to make in that. Like I'd rather have a few products that we do really, really well. Yep. Yep. You know. So just kinda like battling that. And just people ask. You know, people ask a lot, Hey, can you make a cake or a cupcake or

You know, it's it's just a it's a hard balance of knowing like what to really bring on as staple products and there's so much to think through all the time.

Amy (24:55) I'm never mad at a cat's sourdough cookie. No. The chocolate chicken cookies are so good. Yeah. And there's so much chocolate. You're not chintzy with your ingredients

Kat (25:03) With any

Amy (25:04) ever. So about sourdough, can we talk about some of the health benefits? I know you had told me when I first met you that your then boyfriend who you're now married to,

Kat (25:15) Yes.

Amy (25:17) had been seeing good results with eating sourdough with his blood sugar.

Kat (25:21) Yes. We don't really know. he he was slightly I don't know what the right word is. He was diagnosed almost with diabetes. He had a reading come back that was really alarming. He had previously gotten stung by something and now we're wondering if it was a response to that because his blood sugar, thankfully, is doing well now. But there was a period of time where he was really struggling with his blood sugar.

We were having to monitor it with one of those continual monitors and stuff. And it was just I why I knew just based on reading that sourdough doesn't spike your blood sugar. You know. But seeing it was incredible. He could go eat a potato and his blood sugar would be through the roof. He could eat a cinnamon roll and it not spike at all. And you're just like, what?

Amy (26:13) Wow.

Wow, give me I'll take a baker's dozen of those.

Kat (26:18) I you know, so that would for me was so cool to be able to see in real time.

Amy (26:25) Yeah.

Kat (26:26) and so yeah, I just I I can't I I've I've said this a million times. I wish my biggest dream is to have a like a wall of like success stories, you know, of my customers because I've had people literally in tears come to me and say, This is the only bread that I can eat. And

People that haven't, and I know it it might seem like silly thing, but from the beginning I and I've never really known the words to just accurately describe what I'm trying to say, but being able to provide bread to somebody is such a cool thing. It's it's a staple, you know, and it's right.

Amy (27:05) Right.

Kat (27:05) People really enjoy bread, you know.

Amy (27:09) We do like carbs. Yeah. And we and we can tell ourselves it's kind of good for us. It makes it easier even to like it more. But a friend of mine cannot have any gluten at all. She cannot have any cross contamination from it either. And she can go to your baker.

Kat (27:24) Yeah, and I and and while I can't advertise for celiac, that we you know, people that have celiac can have my bread, I cannot tell you the amount of customers that do have it that eat my bread. And it's just so rewarding. I mean, people that have sworn bread off for years that are getting something that not only that they can eat, but they enjoy. Because they can have sandwiches, you know, like they because let's be honest, gluten free bread just isn't good.

Like it might be an option for somebody, but they're not enjoying it. It's what they're what they're forced to eat.

Amy (27:57) Right. Right. Right.

Kat (28:00) And so not only giving them something that settles well with their body, but that they're legitimately saying, This is delicious. Like I want

Amy (28:10) I want to

Kat (28:11) to have is just truly so rewarding. So I'm but yeah, and even to, you know, see that in my husband obvious honestly o obviously has been great. Just

Because he's very

Amy (28:25) Satisfying.

Well, speaking of your husband, this is a great chance to talk about the fact that y'all are both fitness trainers. Yes. And also own a gym. Mm-hmm. And I have fitness questions. Yeah. And I want to talk about fitness because as a middle aged woman, I know there's so much importance of lifting weights and keeping strength and all that. And I do all that. Yeah. But what is it like to own a bakery and a gym at the same time? Some people may say,

Those kind of contradict each other.

Kat (28:56) Yeah.

Amy (28:57) They really don't when it's it seems to be working out pretty well.

Kat (29:00) Yeah, and it it doesn't. I I try to tell people that, you know, when my my big thing when it comes to nutrition, I've always been more on clean eating. I think everything in moderation. So I obviously don't do a lot of low carb, low this, low fat, but you're getting clean ingredients. You're getting real eggs, you're getting real butter. Yeah. Yeah. And I believe that that

personally has worked for me and it is, you know, part of a healthy diet, you know. I think the the businesses have merged really well. Like I said, I got into sourdough because I was cleaning up my diet, which came from the gym.

Amy (29:43) Right. Right, right.

Kat (29:47) I was coaching for six years full time. That really is my passion. And like I said, this wasn't the bakery was

just happened because I was truly happy with where I was and doing that as a career, helping people clean up their diets and be healthier. The bakery is just an extension of that and gives me a bigger platform to be able to provide these healthier options for the community. Even outside of, you know, that that's where I love to talk to people about nutrition is I would rather you eat

whole natural foods than be on some l low carb, highly processed food diet.

Amy (30:29) Right. Right. And there's so many fads and things

Kat (30:32) There's

Amy (30:33) and there's so much content out there, especially, you know, with the world wide web telling you, you got one trainer on a page telling you to do this and another telling you this. And they're all like all Instagram people. Yeah. And I don't know if they really even know what they're talking about. They might, but I never know what is right or what is

Kat (30:50) There's so much conflicting information out there. Yeah. And that's why I really like to take it back to the basics with people. If you can't read it, you probably shouldn't eat it. Just because it's on the shelves doesn't mean that it's meant for human consumption. I'm sorry that that's the situation that we're in right now. But it is

Amy (31:06) Yep.

Kat (31:07) and so yeah, I just try to offer people foods that are natural that come from the earth.

Amy (31:14) Yeah. Yeah.

Kat (31:15) In the most simplistic way I know. I'm I'm much more concerned.

about that than the calories. Not to say eat ten thousand cinnamon rolls a day. But like I said, I do believe in everything in moderation. I do believe getting back to the basics, making things simple. You know, it's not that hard. It's not.

Amy (31:35) Yeah.

Kat (31:36) We overthink it and people most I I'm a big believer that a lot of people are walking around inflamed, not overweight.

Amy (31:44) That's a good point. I I could see that from their diet. From their diet.

Kat (31:47) Yeah. Yeah.

You know, we're we're like I said, we're eating things that weren't meant for human consumption. So

Amy (31:53) Well

what are what are some things that are routines you recommend as a fitness guru of food? I mean, technically you you guys sp some people could say a bakery and a fitness. I don't know if anybody's ever said that. I mean

Kat (32:05) They do.

Amy (32:06) both, but like they kind of work in tandem with each other. One is healthy, whole, simple foods and the other is your exercise because you can't outrun a fork, as they say. Right. So what are some daily routines? Like when somebody comes in to you and is a new client.

And they're gonna work out with you. Are you saying like, walk three days a week, do weights three days a week? There's so much conflicting information in that too.

Kat (32:30) Yeah. I am a huge, huge, huge, huge believer in weight training. I think it is highly underrated. I think that women in particular shy away from it. I think it's really misunderstood. And that is where I spend a lot of my time and where my passion is, is specifically with women in weight training and getting them to understand why it's important. Because they're the most scared. You know, I hear all the time I don't want to be bulky.

Or it's heavy, it's hard, I'm gonna get hurt. You know, right. There's so much. Right. Right. but exercise really shouldn't be complicated. But I am a big believer in trying to get women in the gym and lifting weights at least three times a week and staying active. That's the main thing outside of that is whatever that needs to be for you walking, pickleball, swimming, I don't care, movement, you know.

Amy (33:27) I try to do a balance of everything, especially being in menopause. You really have to keep the muscle and all that. And I was at my gym a few weeks ago and I was we were lifting kettleballs and the trainer came up and said, Amy, you can lift heavier than that. Yeah. And I was like, me? Women don't know me? Yeah. Like, wow. And so she's like, take this instead of that. And I was like, wow. Like she's seeing me progress. Yes. And that's so remarkable.

Kat (33:54) Aggressive overloading is often missed, especially again with women. I think a frustrating part in the industry is that everybody thinks they can train and there is a science behind it. Being in a legitimate program where you're progressively overloading is where you're going to actually see your muscles grow. So what I mean by that is a lot and and women are particularly targeted with hey, pick up the ten pound dumbbells for twenty five reps or get your heart rate up with just light weight. And that

That's not strength training. And I think that that's a a very common misconception. You need to be lifting heavier and being in a an actual program that is continually increasing your strength. My what a lot of women don't know is what you already alluded to, is the amount of muscle that we lose after the age of 40 and bone health. One in two women.

One in two women will break a bone past 50, which is alarming. strength training, but under load is what builds our bones. So more than even muscle is I talk to women about their bones because we're much more at risk for osteoporosis. But you only build that muscle when you're under load. And that's why strength training is why I'm so passionate about it. Often too.

People always say you'll hear this a lot, like, well, once I hit forty, like I started gaining all this weight, or you know, I can't lose all this weight. Well, muscle burns fat. So if you've been doing cardio your whole life and then now we're losing muscle at a drastic pace,

Amy (35:30) Right.

Kat (35:31) muscle is what burns fat. So if we didn't spend, you know, our twenties and thirties building muscle and now you're losing muscle, then you're gonna put on fat a lot quicker, you know.

That's why I try and encourage girls in their twenties and in their thirties, like this is your time to build. I don't care if you're not gonna get bulky, but that's not that's not the priority. Women are so focused on what they're gonna look like

Amy (35:54) Right.

Kat (35:55) instead of what's healthy for them.

Amy (35:57) Well for me, I'm a pretty confident person. I I you know, I can but then I walk into the gym and I'm like a I'm like a lost puppy. I'm like I do not know. I I feel very vulnerable when I'm in a gym at fifty three years old. Yeah. And I listen but to them and I do what I'm supposed to do and I'm really humble about modifying. Yeah. Because with, you know, some herniated discs in my back and twenty six years of painting, my neck has taken

An arthritic toll. So there's things I'm not willing to do. And one of the sweet trainers there said the other day, he said, you know, you can can you not do that? Do you need help? I think it was a something with my vertigo, I can't do sit ups. Mm. So I was like, Yeah. And he I'd never met him before. And I was like, I have to modify a lot. And I said, I'd rather be here and do a little than nothing. And he was like, Yeah, give me five. Like that's the attitude. Yeah. Because I can't

be like the guy that's next to me with you know lifting huge we I I'm not trying to be that. Yeah. But I do think women, we do care so much how we look that that I just want to be strong and not break that

Kat (37:06) Right. And everybody like where where I work, in particular my husband's gym, a lot of people are shied away from it because it looks too intense. They think they have to have some exercise background to

Amy (37:17) Yeah.

Kat (37:17) start. I've trained people in wheelchairs there. It's it's called functional fitness because it really is for everybody. And I think that's really important. People don't understand that everybody has a baseline and everybody's baseline's different. The important thing is that whoever you're working with.

Find your baseline and grows you

Amy (37:38) Right.

Kat (37:39) at your pace, at your level. I'm training my mom right now, you know, she has osteoporosis. Yeah. Yeah. Her baseline's different than other 65 year olds that I've worked with. You know, she has different hurdles. She's coming with different things, injuries, this and that.

A talented, a skilled, a trained trainer knows how to find your baseline and knows your limits and knows how to push you in a safe way and in a way that you're still growing and not staying the same.

Amy (38:09) Yeah, I like being pushed. I like someone literally noticing that I can do something I don't realize I can do yet. Exactly. And and then I leave and I'm like, yeah, I'm like, I'm like, let's go. I'm ready. Like I feel strong and empowered and it starts the day off better. I will say that walking is so therapeutic. yeah. A friend of mine have consistent and a a friend of mine and I have consistently walked, usually a Tuesday or Wednesday morning for

Almost four years. We have consistently gone and we make it a priority. Yeah. And we walk four miles and sometimes it takes a lot longer. Yeah. Because we're distracted and we're talking about, you know, all the things. And sometimes we're faster and we're very flexible if one of us can't go, but we make that a standing priority. Yeah. Walking the dog as well too is helpful. But I love walking.

Kat (39:00) Yeah, walking's great. I do try to differentiate with people the difference between movement and exercise because I think that that gets a little intertwined. I am a big advocate for movement, you know, whether that, like I said, walking, pickleball, swimming, biking, I don't care. But exercise is intentional and it's your heart rate's gonna get up and it's gonna be hard.

Amy (39:20) Right. Right.

Kat (39:21) And those are the differences, you know. And I think both are important. You know, your your daily activity level is important.

You know, we're just we're just sedentary as as a culture at this day and age. You know, so we we have to make time for movement. Right. And that's not something that we used to have to do, you know. Right. So I do try to differentiate to people movement and 'cause my mom's a perfect example. There's not a woman out there that hasn't walked. I mean, she has walked every day of her life, you know, but she's very frail. And so she's not overweight, but she's very frail.

You know, and so people need to understand what what they're doing and why to align with their goals and where where they need to be at, you know. Yeah. And it's just a matter of educating the public. You know, it's really hard because there is so much out there. It's it's a tough industry, you know. Well

Amy (40:16) What's what's your f if you could had if you could only do like one exercise every time you go to the gym, what would it be? Okay. Okay.

Kat (40:21) I'm a back squat. I

love to squat. I think it's super important. Leg strength, and this is what I'm working through with my mom right now. Leg strength is one of the biggest indicators of overall health and longevity. So leg strength in particular. So I'm a big advocate that people need to squat. I mean, we're we're we're we gotta squat down to go to the bathroom. So I continue to get off the toilet as you age, you

Amy (40:45) True.

Kat (40:46) need to be able to squat. True. So the whole

Heart and soul behind functional fitness, if you ever hear that phrase, is mimicking movements that we're doing in everyday life and putting them under load so that you stay stronger in those movements as you age. Everybody's deadlifting because everybody's picking something off the ground. Everybody's squatting because they're going to the bathroom. Everybody's lifting overhead. So these are fun these are foundational movements that we're all doing in everyday life that we need to have the range of motion for and we need to train under load so that.

We reduce our risk of injury as we age.

Amy (41:20) Yeah, I never really thought about it that way. Mimicking daily movements like that. Now I'm next time I'm at the gym I'm gonna be like, well that's like, you know, that daily activity.

Kat (41:28) Like a farmer's carry, you know, you're holding two weights and walking. Well, what do we do? We carry groceries.

Amy (41:33) Yeah.

Kat (41:35) you know, so I I love I love I could talk about fitness forever. I love how it correlates with everyday life. I just think it's it's it it shouldn't be an option. Is it

Amy (41:47) Or is it a myth that we should ingest protein within thirty minutes to forty five minutes of a workout? Yes. It's true.

Kat (41:53) Yeah.

I it is true, although I'm a big advocate for whole foods pro whole food protein as opposed to protein powders. I think we're overdoing it in the industry. I'm like go eat a piece of chicken. Yeah. Or some Even if you worked a cup of beans,

Amy (42:11) Chicken.

Kat (42:11) you know, or some eggs. Again, I think I think that with everything you have to be you have to be careful. The health industry is a money making industry too. yeah. So it's not all

Innocent two. Yeah. So protein powders, you know, like I think as an occasional okay, like you're in a bind, you know. But no, I'm not an advocate of hitting the gym and crushing, you know, fifty grams of protein via a protein powder. But yes, I do think that within thirty to forty five minutes nourishing your body is important. That is a window that matters.

Amy (42:46) 'Cause

I hear that. You never know, like like the internet, you know I never know whose advice. I mean, I would take your advice, I eat your bread. Yeah.

Kat (42:54) Yeah. Well, you know, you wanna you y to me, just look at the person, you know? Observe their lifestyle. Right. Like are they like are they healthy?

Amy (43:04) Right. Right. You know? True, true. So well one one of my pet peeves of the gym is people who are talking during like a class or it it it is I I have to stay so focused and I literally have to put so much mental toughness into pretending that there's nobody around me just to even do what I'm supposed to do there. Right. So that is a mental exercise for me sometimes when there's talkers in the gym. I have to literally be like, okay

Focus on what you're doing, get the right weight, be careful, tune out everything around you and don't listen to talking. Like just do what you gotta do, Amy.

Kat (43:41) Yeah, and it and that gets better over time. You know, when it is it is like that was something when I first started coaching. It took me a minute. I was like, wow, these people are really out of their environments. You know, like they're they're like these are smart people. Like they're they've got jobs. You know, you get into the gym and they're a little disoriented. Like I like it really took me off guard. You know, but it gets better. And I I'm glad that you brought up the mental side of it because

We just had this week at the gym where it's it's called Mystery Week, but it's it's a really hard week. We work out really hard at for five days. And I I get reminded every year of what I'm capable of, you know, and I love that. And I I love the correlation between exercise and everyday life because one one of the things that I love about the exercise that we do in particular is the goals that you have to s it's strategic. Like I love the mental.

aspect of exercise. People always are like the physical, the bones, the the muscles, yes, that's great. But what it does for your mental health is wild.

Amy (44:44) And sleep.

I sleep so much better on days of exercise.

Kat (44:48) Yeah.

But so so many times I'll be in a workout and all I can think about is what I have to get done. Like I've got to finish five reps. I can't think about the whole workout. I can't think about, you know, how much more I have to do. I have to think about what I have to do right now. Right now I have to get through five more reps. I'm gonna pick up this bar and I'm gonna do five more reps, and that's what I can do right now. And that has correlated so much to the bakery of being able to buy it all. What can I do right now?

Like I can't think of ten w ten steps from now. I have to think about what I can do right now. And I'm gonna do it. And that

Amy (45:24) The drive that you I see and hear you talking about right now is the drive I saw as you were a brand new business on your door when I would we would talk on your doorstep. I there were I always saw so much potential in you. I didn't think you'd like rock starred out this quickly, but you really did. Yeah. All right. Well, we're getting near the end and w what what I like to do in the end is a rapid fire.

Kat (45:47) Okay.

Amy (45:47) And it's kind of like a this or that. Yeah. And so let's go.

Kat (45:51) Okay.

Amy (45:52) Bagel or cookie.

Kat (45:53) Cookie, okay?

Amy (45:55) Sandwich loaf or artisan loaf.

Kat (45:57) Sandwich. No, artist and love. Artisan Love. Really? Yeah. Yeah, actually, yes. I know that's surprising. But yes, I I am a sucker for the artisan love.

Amy (46:05) Is it because there's more creativity that goes into it?

Kat (46:07) I just think with toasted with butter, like special. Like I don't know, like the heartiness of it, you know? I just it's special.

Amy (46:17) Alright, well I know the answer to this. Weights are cardio. Wait. Squats are deadlifts.

Kat (46:20) Yeah. Squat.

Amy (46:23) Chocolate smoothie or vanilla?

Kat (46:25) Ooh,

chocolate. I'm a chocolate girly. Girly

Amy (46:28) Early bird or night owl.

Kat (46:30) bird. Hate the nights.

As much as you work. I have to be, but you know, I'm gonna talk about this because I think this is funny. People always think this is hilarious when I say this because it's true. I distinguish a morning and a night person between your brain, how you process troubles or any conflict. In the morning, someone can come to me with.

Everything's failing, the the building's on fire, and I'm like, okay, that's fine. We're gonna fix it. You come to me like that at nighttime and I'm gonna cry. Okay.

Amy (47:02) Yeah, okay okay.

Kat (47:03) You know, I my ability to process is, you know, just not there at nighttime. You know, I'm I'm much more stressed if if stressful situations come up. You know, my tolerance is just

Amy (47:15) What

time do you usually wake up every day?

Kat (47:17) But now I'm kind of like my kids are older. I'm kinda in that like six o'clock, seven o'clock. No I used to be a strict four AM. Oof. Yeah. Wow. So this is feeling really luxurious. But

Amy (47:30) But you didn't get where you are by sleeping in. Okay. You never will. You never will. No. That should be a goal for all especially women. Speaking is you're not gonna get anything accomplished by sleeping in the bed.

Kat (47:42) No. And I will say one thing that's changed as of recently is my my kids are older and they stay up later. You know, they'll be text so I'm forced later.

Amy (47:52) To stay.

Kat (47:53) You know, and I do try to prioritize my sleep, but

Amy (47:56) Yeah. And sleep is a very important component of fitness and wealth.

Kat (48:01) When you're j when you're juggling everything that you gotta be at your best. You know, people used to ask, Well, how do you work out when you're doing the bakery and this and that? I'm like, I have to. Like I have to be my best to be able to be my best. You know, like I have to invest in myself to be able to give what I need to give to the community, to my employees, to my kids, to my family. Like I still prioritize self care and very much so. That's exercise. yeah, absolutely.

Amy (48:25) So that's not easy. Smoothie

or a sa e bowl. Smoothie. Okay. I've never had one of your asa ebowls, by the way.

Kat (48:34) You know, I tasted

Amy (48:35) I've never had one.

Kat (48:37) I yeah I I never had had one before I opened. So wow. I was like, Wait, what's an ice a evil?

Amy (48:44) friend who routinely goes in there like once a week for one.

Kat (48:47) The berry buzz is delicious. I do love it. I just I I I mm I don't know.

Amy (48:53) Well one thing I know I I love the croutons. I mean I love everything there, but the croutons are so good. Yes. And I was gonna ask you croutons or crackers? Crackers. Okay, okay. Well you have your crackers, all the croutons. Although I really do like your crackers. I like there's nothing there that I don't like.

Kat (49:07) Yeah. They're there's not.

Amy (49:10) Everything's delicious. So it's amazing to have you where s the community is so proud of you because you have put a community together at Cats. It's like a cult following there. You I don't think I might have said it earlier. You literally cannot go there without seeing someone I know. Yeah. And sometimes I'm I went to Cats to get a loaf of bread and thirty minutes later because we're all talking in there, because we're all what you get, how you doing? It is a lovely community. It's a wonderful addition.

I know that Germantown, Memphis, and beyond, apparently Nashville now that you're shipping to them, are really proud of you. And we really love to eat what you bake. So

Kat (49:48) Well thank you.

Amy (49:49) I just wanna leave us with what is one word? And if one word doesn't work, what's a paragraph or a few sentences that would describe cat sourdough?

Kat (50:01) I hope love and commitment to quality, you know, trust, those are things that come to mind. I think that's huge in this day and age. And I hope people trust what we're doing and trust that we're doing it the right way and truly have a love and a passion for for providing for the community. That that truly is what some

Amy (50:22) The consumer of your product

and someone who goes in there frequently, I feel all that. So well, everybody, we are so happy you tuned in today. A fun little fact here is Kat is my first official podcast guest. And she really made it quite easy on me because she's very conversational, very informative, and just a lovely lady to have on. So we really appreciate you. Everybody, check out Kat's sourdough.

We will make a post about her and have her socials and everything and links to her page and everything. Although I think half my listeners probably already go there. So everybody, till next time.